Panic at the comments desk
From the many references to missing comments, it appears that something has changed in a big way over the past few days, and whoever is editing the comments has no clue what they're doing. Perhaps the senior editors don't know what this person is doing either. In any case it's pissing a lot of people off unnecessarily. Someone needs to reread the rules, straighten up and fly right.
16 comments:
to Courier of 1/3/11 - City on clean up: 'I've never had to deal with this much snow' City hopes to plow all streets by Tuesday; council discusses effort at 2 p.m. meeting. - Joanna Dodder Nellans
http://prescottdailycourier.com/main.asp?SectionID=1&SubsectionID=1&ArticleID=89132
...was edited as follows:
What I wrote late in the 3rd paragraph wuz: "Be nice if the streets was plowed and cops don't be shootin' peoples for having a small knife in they own house."
What the Courier allowed was: "Be nice if the streets was plowed".
I wondered if it were the crappy pseudo-Ebonics that got busted or was it the stab at the cops?...and I wrote to complain about that censorship in a comment that also never appeared. Here is the text of that "disappeared" comment:
"Every time the Courier's Church Lady edits (censors) my stuff without so much as the courtesy of claiming a Terms of Use violation I feel so... well, refudiated. You're s'pose to get paid for that kind of abuse."
(submitted 01/06/11 @ 1741; disappeared)
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I'm such a strong believer in freedom of expression that I can't help but be bothered by this kind of editorial behavior, and even wrote a comment (which they did post) in favor of letting even nonsensical comments being posted. It's a long comment so I won't include it here, but if you want to read that it's here:
http://prescottdailycourier.com/main.asp?SectionID=1&SubsectionID=1&ArticleID=87003
I never write, and do not believe they need allow the likes of "n" or "f" or "c" words that the general public would find offensive, and I'm careful to refrain from personal attacks, -- but I remain firmly of the opinion that if you're in the position (as the Courier is) of presenting journalistic endeavor in a public venue you need to develop a "rhino hide" toughness than enables you to countenance even scathing criticism -- even though you may think it specious. None of us that criticize the Courier's efforts seem to do so out of mean-spiritedness, but are merely attempting to advocate a better quality of journalism. Having our fingers duct-taped for this effort seems small-minded, and I am disappointed.
Weideranders once sent me an e-mail complaining about how much time he spent sifting through and approving/editing comments. From that exchange I concluded the guy has no journalistic ethics (i.e. the comments he did edit, including many of my own never had any sort of attribution attached to reflect the edits). If comments are still getting disappeared or edited without any attribution, I imagine Tim is still doing it.
P.S. I got the heck out of Arizona once its future appeared to be going even more dystopian, but I still check your site on occasion. Good luck out there with MAd Max and all the mutants and whatnot.
Yep, there new church mouse is over the top with censoring words or phrases. A few of the censored items were cut & pasted from previous post. From a previous posting, I can now name the organization that is looking at the Courier's terms of use and the unequal application of the censorship pen. I can't stand the organization in general, but I hope the ACLU representatives use the citations that they think will win their case. Either way, it will highlight the corrupt application uused by the Courier to censor news & personal ideas.
One problem I've had is that when one of my comments get the "boot" I never know why. Once I send my comment I no longer have a copy myself so I'm not really sure what I've said that warranted my piece being rejected. I never get an explanation. As I stated here the other day I simply posted a comment about the tea-party's use of a flag that for years has been associated with right-wing militia and other anti-government groups and for some unknown reason (or more likely no reason at all other than my known positions on other issues) it was not seen as fit to print. Yet I see others (notably of a right leaning) getting by with posts that are truly hateful and over the top. Were it not for the fact that I know others share my views and need support in this right-wing town I don't think I would continue even trying.
This comment showed up as an email alert but not on the blog, for some reason --
birther t. bagur: Weideranders once sent me an e-mail complaining about how much time he spent sifting through and approving/editing comments. From that exchange I concluded the guy has no journalistic ethics (i.e. the comments he did edit, including many of my own never had any sort of attribution attached to reflect the edits). If comments are still getting disappeared or edited without any attribution, I imagine Tim is still doing it.
P.S. I got the heck out of Arizona once its future appeared to be going even more dystopian, but I still check your site on occasion. Good luck out there with Mad Max and all the mutants and whatnot.
Birther's comment is the first confirmation I've had that Tim took over handling comments when Ben left. I've said before that having a senior editor spending time on this seems unutterably wasteful, it's an intern's job. I have to wonder whether he's taken that advice and given it to someone less senior, but with too much discretion.
Great stuff, Coyote and PK. Again, I recommend to everyone that you write your comments offline and paste them into the comments box so you have local copies, at least until they show up on dCourier. That way you also can compare for more subtle editing.
About 6 months I got a e-mail from Tim asking me to call him regarding a comment I had made. I had submitted a comment but had it censored. I complained and ended up talking to Tim. I started out by saying that someone who didn't know any better must have been doing the "editing" and maybe he could check into it. That's when he told me that he was the one doing the reading and editing. I felt a bit foolish and after a sorry attempt to extract my foot from my mouth I held back on posting for a while. But it seems to have gotten much worse so what the hell. Censorship is eventuality found out and exposed. Where it goes from there is anybody's guess. Who knows. Maybe this site will suddenly find it's self "in violation" of an "agreement". I certainly hope not.
PK, once you got past who did the editing, how did Tim respond to your concerns?
I have to say that he came off as a little defensive. I could tell that he was getting frustrated with the general discourse in a lot of the on-line comments and he said as much. People going after each other etc..and I have to agree up to a point. But in a way he was cautioning me to tone it down. Of course comparatively I don't feel that I'm the one who needs to tone it down and be snapped "into line". Who would've guessed.
Steve, I think we’ve finally uncovered the base problems at the Courier. Please comment on the following. First they promoted an inbred family member to head the organization. Comments were not allowed. She is intertwined with a local political group and the city. Since we all comment regularly on the sophomoric reporting, usually just a copy of paste of other written stories. Heck, I read most of the news about the Prescott area in the Phoenix news a day or two before it appears in the Courier. There has never been any in-depth investigative reporting on the city government and departments as they relate to incompetence, corruption, or malfeasance. Being the only “news’ organization in town, this begs the question. If the local news is minimal at best & slanted, censored if facts come out about LEO or members of the leadership, unprofessional & poorly written non-journalistic articles; then how can they call themselves a newspaper? Reminds me of the green sheets we used pre-indoor plumbing. I’m sure the lack of competition, beholding to special interests, and the lack of talent in the area are a major aspect, but what are we the citizens to do if we can’t get more investigative reporting on local issues or corrupt business dealings? Why won’t or can’t they change to become a real news organization reporting on the most sensitive aspects of our city? They rarely report about LEO misdeeds or various corrupt dealings in the city. The citizens need & want immediate change, but lacking competition, how do we get the word out?
You asked me to comment, and let me start by saying that you'd carry a lot more weight if you'd use your name.
Starting out by calling the publisher's family "inbred" is a) very probably false, b) boorish and c) undermines your credibility.
Anyone reading this blog likely cares about whether our local news monopoly is doing a good job, and since we're news junkies we'd like more and better reporting. But every organization is limited by the talent and resources available to it, I get that. I keep this blog to let the editors know that some of us at least are paying attention, thereby to encourage harder work to get it right. Nothing we say here will change editorial bias, but calling them on it will help keep it in check.
I can't comment on things I don't know are happening. If you do, feel free to share here, or create your own medium. But own what you do, use your name and consider how your tone is likely to affect your readers. This last comment approaches crazy talk.
Well, I gave Tim a chance to comment but as usual it never went to print. I guess he doesn't have the stones of a real newpaper person. Most live to right a wrong or expose dishonest corruption, but not our Courier. I wouldn't talk with him one on one anyway, but one can only conclude that the Courier is a fraud & only really intended to secure adversisement dollars and report about Ms Johnson's gout or sewing circle. I highly recommend that everyone withhold their advertising dollars, subscriptions, and comments until the citizens can force a major shakeup at the Courier.
Steve, I can respect you opinion even if somewhat off base. On advice of my Corporate Counsel I have been advised not to use the name as it might create various difficulties for the business at several of our locations. I pose the question, what better way to compel change than for a large segment of the local population to put their money where their collective mouths are, an activism if you will? How else can the average citizen compel the Courier to change? As far as the word 'inbred', I couldn't think of another word at the moment to identify an internal promotion complete with all the special interest leanings and baggage. Sounded right at the time, but I'm far from being a wordsmith.
Well to be completely honest I know there has been at least one time when a comment I posted was censored and I ended up thankful it was. Sometimes one can get pretty worked up over what we read and then post accordingly. But once you post it, it's out there, good or bad. Kind of hard to take it back. Still the censoring seems to me to be a bit excessive.
To clarify, I dredged up Tim's e-mail to me and he said that "we" spend a lot of our "free time" (which he referred to as a sort of misnomer) editing and approving comments. The clusterf___ known as the Prescott Courier comment section is an entirely group effort, but the decision to make it such is solely the work of ownership and editors/managers.
On the subject of ownership, there have been a couple occasions where I wrote comments noting that the Courier is owned by a family in Yuma that contributes to Republicans (I looked up some examples on Open Secrets once) and probably demands a certain bias and editorial slant in their coverage (or what they don't bother to cover, which is a bias in itself).
I honestly wouldn't have a problem with this (I am a fan of the 'view from nowhere' theory developed by NYU Journolism Prof Jay Rosen--you can look this up easily), as long as they were up front and honest about it, but the fact they aren't, and cover up their bias through North Korean-style comment section hi-jinks and an 'only poorly written liberals in the letters section' policy is the biggest problem there.
I at least take comfort in the fact that this is eating the place like a cancer and will contribute to the eventual bankruptcy.
Again to clarify: The comments I wrote showing how the ownership of the Courier were Republicans never showed up in the comments section, even thought they did not violate the written terms of use agreement.
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